By: Brady Lavin
Simon Kirke began his long love affair with rock n roll back in 1968 when he helped found influential British rock band Free, in which he was the drummer. Moving onward and upward, he and Paul Rodgers formed the legendary Bad Company five years later, with Simon drumming and Paul singing.
Simon enjoyed huge success on both-sides of the Atlantic, and elsewhere, with Bad Company, touring all over the world for decades, but he never got to play his own music, as others were always the principal songwriters. This all changed recently, when he finally found time to record an album of twelve of his compositions, entitled Filling The Void
Known primarily as a drummer, Kirke takes this opportunity to showcase his skilled guitar, bass and piano playing, while also adding his time-tested drum skills to most of the tracks.
Taking time from his busy schedule of solo shows, Simon Kirke recently had a chat about his songs, recording, and his long years with Bad Company with Guitar International.
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Brady Lavin: Most music fans know you from your drumming work in Free and Bad Company, but you’ve also played guitar for nearly as long as the drums. What is your relationship to the guitar compared to your main instrument?
Simon Kirke: I’ve been playing guitar as long as I’ve been playing drums. It’s my second instrument; I’ve been playing forty-five years or so. I always have one with me, always carry one around when I’m on the road. I have a little collection of nice guitars in my house. I love it!
Brady: How long has the material on Filling the Void been in the works?
Simon Kirke: Some of the songs go back about ten years, and one song, “One Day Closer,” was written two months ago in April, so it spans about a ten year period.
Brady: How was it like trying to put all those songs from such a wide time period onto one album?
Simon Kirke: It was quite a juggling act, actually. I recorded about fifteen and put four, no put three aside, and we ended up with twelve. But you know, really, the songs themselves aren’t really time constricted. You can’t really tell that one song was written in 2003 and another was written in 1998. There’s no real time stamp on any of them. But I wanted there to be a variety, so I didn’t want too many slow ones, didn’t want too many rockers. I wanted a nice mixed bag, as it were.
Brady: Much of the subject matter on Filling the Void seems to focus on love and addiction. Can you elaborate on the inspiration for your songs, lyrically and musically?
Simon Kirke: Oh yeah, I never really thought of it like that, love and addiction. Look I’m quite open about the fact that I have had a period or a history of substance abuse, so I opened the album with “Filling the Void,” which is what that deals with. And if it helps anyone along the way, which I understand it has because I get messages on my website. So I’m pleased with the experience, I’m not shy about it.
And love, well love is the great muse, isn’t it? It’s why we’re all here. We’re the result of love in some form or another. I do get a lot of inspiration from that, yeah.
Brady: You play most of the instruments on this solo release…
Simon Kirke: I played a lot of instruments, but I didn’t play all the instruments on all the songs. I want to make that clear. A couple of the songs, yes, I did play all the instruments, but I had some fine musicians with me helping on most of the tracks.
Brady: On those tracks where you did play the majority of the instruments, what challenges and opportunities did doing that offer?
Simon Kirke: It was bloody difficult! Say on “One Day Closer,” which was written on guitar. I would play a backing track to a drum machine, and on that I played a Martin ’76, which is the bicentennial edition for you guitar fans out there. So I played to a click track, and once the guitar was done, I would play proper drums to the guitar. I played drums over the click track and then erase the click track.
I would have my guitar and drums track, and then I would play the bass on top of that and start doing piano and vocals. So it was a quite a challenge, particularly to keep the feel interesting because I find when one person plays everything, it runs the danger of being just one-dimensional. That’s why I wanted other people playing one the tracks. But some couldn’t make it, so I thought, “What the hell, I’ll give it a try,” and I’m very pleased with the results.
Brady: What other musicians did you have come in and help you out?
Simon Kirke: Well, I live in New York City. I’ve been here since 1996, so I know quite a few musicians. Primarily I used John Conte on bass. He played bass on most of the tracks. Wonderful player. His brother Steve Conte played guitar on “I Want You Back” and “Fly to Your Side.” And then Jeff Kazee, who plays on quite a few tracks. He plays with Southside Johnny and the Asbury Jukes. Great player, great player.
And then I had G.E. Smith, from the Saturday Night Live band. He used to play with them. He played on “Talk to the Hand,” did a great blues solo. I think he did it in one take. He was only in the studio about ten minutes. He was great, a lovely player.
I had a horn section on a couple of songs, and I’ve always wanted to have a sax player on a song, so on “Make Up Your Mind” I had a horn section. And the sax player played on “Jaunty Sarcasm” and “Melting on Madison,” just to add that sophisticated touch to the songs. His name was Art Hays, great player.
Brady: What was it like to record your own material as opposed to all the years spent playing other composers’ songs in Free and Bad Company?
Simon Kirke: It was bloody frightening! [Laughs] You know, I was a little naked and unadorned. I don’t know if you have this saying over here, “The proof of the pudding is in the eating.” I would have this song in mind, and I’m thinking, “Well, if it sounds good tomorrow, then I’ll keep it.” Once the song stood up to the test of having all the overdubs on it, if it still sounded good the next day, I was pleased with it.
And also, I got of encouragement from the guys. They all liked the songs, and they made them sound so much better than if I’d done all of them myself, which I didn’t really want to do. It was a challenge.
So I rented this arena where I’m putting out my songs to the critics, and I’ll have to take it on the chin if they like them or if they don’t. But I’m very pleased and very proud of the album myself.
Brady: You have been the only member of Bad Company to remain in the band through all the different incarnations. How did the constantly-changing personnel affect you, personally and musically?
Simon Kirke: Yeah, that’s true. Well, it’s been since 1973, which is, my god, thirty-eight years ago. It’s been a rollercoaster ride.
I’ve learned a lot. I much prefer the original lineup to any of the other subsequent lineups. I think Paul Rodgers is the voice of the band, and Mick Ralphs is the guitarist. And on bass, Boz Burell, and I suppose me on drums. But we did try other people along the way. I didn’t want to let the band die just because other members didn’t want to continue.
It worked to a degree, and on other levels it didn’t work. Some people were disappointed when Paul didn’t want to be in the band, so we got Brian Howe in. We kind of adopted a new sound. It worked for that time, in the late ’80s.
It didn’t enhance the Bad Company name, but it was just something we had to try and we kept the band alive. I think it was and still is a pretty amazing band. It’s just gone through some changes; it’s like a chameleon. Like any band or anyone who has a long career, there’s going a little dip in the quality. There were times when we were guilty of that.
Brady: Brian Howe has been quoted as saying that the reason he left Bad Company was that he was tired of doing all the work. Can you give another side of that story?
Simon Kirke: [Laughs] Yeah I heard that, I did hear that, that he was tired of doing all the work. Oh dear, well without getting your legal department very busy… [Laughs] Look, he’s entitled to his opinion. He, quite honestly, didn’t fit in the band. That is the honest truth. At times he was hard to work with, as I’m sure I was, but his personality and our personalities did clash towards the end. We just didn’t get along, and so we parted ways. Whether or not he did most of the work, that’s up for debate, but we did have some productive time with him. We did make some pretty good music with him, so I’m going to look back on it with mainly fond memories. And that’s as diplomatic as I can be. Aren’t you going to ask me about some of my guitars?
Brady: Oh, please, tell us about your guitars!
Simon Kirke: [Laughs] I don’t have a huge collection of guitars, but I do have my favorites. You know, I always take a guitar with me on the road, and up until recently I took a Martin D76, which is the bicentennial edition that Martin made in 1976. They only made 1976 of them. I think they were modeled after the D35. One of your readers can correct me on that.
I have a beautiful 1963 Gibson Hummingbird, which I’ve got strung to Nashville tuning, which most of your readers will probably know about. It’s the most wonderful tuning, very ringy, very bell-like, and I used that on several of the tracks.
And I’ve got a Zemaitis that Ronnie Wood gave me for my wedding many years ago, a mother of pearl body inlaid 1980 Zemaitis. I have a 1963 Fender Precision bass, and all the tracks that I played bass on the album, that was the bass that I used. So those are my big five guitars that I’m really proud of.
I’ve other little things, you know, little baby Martins and things, but those are the ones that really stand out. I love playing guitar, what can I say?
And I’ve got to mention, and I’m not even getting an endorsement, but I use John Pearse strings. Oh, they’re wonderful strings! James Taylor mentioned them in American Songwriter. I just wanted to mention them. I’ve tried so many strings throughout my life, but these are my favorites. They’re velvety and they’re crisp, silky. They’ve got everything a string should have.
Brady: You’ve been a musician in various bands for over 40 years now. How has your approach to music changed over the years?
Simon Kirke: My approach to writing music hasn’t really changed, honestly. I mean, the equipment and the techniques that I use to capture the music has changed, of course, although I still use a little cassette recorder. The little one I got from Radio Shack. When I really want to get an idea down quickly, instead of setting up the Pro Tools rig, I just hit Play and Record on this little cassette recorder.
Look, music is just a way of projecting and capturing your emotions whether it’s love or whether it’s hate or anger or fear of passion. It’s a wonderful way of capturing and projecting your emotions to other people. One of the most moving songs on the album for me was “Message From the Lost,” which I wrote when I was working with the Red Cross down at Ground Zero. That song took about twenty minutes to write because, having witnessed the first parents, the first relatives to come down to the site, it was such a powerful emotion that I had to get it down. I had to record it.
Other songs didn’t have the same impact, so it took longer. Some songs come quickly, some take months. It doesn’t mean to say that they’re better or worse than the other ones. I guess what I’m trying to say is that I write because I love writing, and if it helps or if it affects other people when they listen, I get a real kick out of it.
For example, someone lost their brother in the north tower of the World Trade Center, and I had no idea when I played it at this songwriters circle. Some of them were actually weeping, and I said before I played the song, “Look, if you don’t want to hear this, I certainly understand.” She was… it really touched her, it really moved her.
The same with “Over There,” the song I wrote about the soldiers in Afghanistan and Iraq. I just had to write about it, and now it’s out there. I just hope some people get something out of it because it’s meant to honor these guys. That’s all.
Brady: With Paul Rodgers saying there are no future plans for Bad Company and this solo album complete, what does the future hold for Simon Kirke?
Simon Kirke: It’s funny, the way you phrase that question, it sounds like Filling the Void pertains to what I’m doing now that Bad Company is not doing anything. Actually, I’ve never thought of it like that. I’m not filling the void left by Paul and Mick not working, although it could be construed as that.
This is something I’ve wanted to do for a long, long time. I’ve got loads of songs. I do plan to make other solo albums, and this allowed me the chance to get these songs out and see how they would stand up being played by professional musicians. So I finally found a window of time in which to do it. So far, the reaction has been pretty positive, so I’m very pleased.
But I hope Bad Company does some more shows because we’re still a very good band. We still enjoy playing.
Brady: So… possibly some more solo material will surface in the future?
Simon Kirke: You know, I do solo shows. I don’t go out with a band. I go out with a good friend of mine, Larry Oakes. He actually played second guitar in Bad Company for a few years.
So I go out with him, I play guitar and piano, he plays guitar and piano, and we swap instruments. I play a couple of Free songs, quite a few Bad Company songs, and I play some of my own. I like to do solo shows, but I wouldn’t go out with a band, no. Once you get into that merry-go-round, you got to have a bass player, and you got to have a drummer. Oh I suppose I could play drums, though, couldn’t I? [Laughs] Then you have to have roadies and semi-trucks and busses, so I’m quite happy to play my solo shows. I’m gonna be doing some shows in L.A. and Vegas and Texas, so I will be posting all that on my website.
I absolutely love playing solo shows. It gives me a chance to step out from behind the kit and talk and be a little bit more intimate with the audience.
